(No eggs)

3 c. flour
2 c sugar
6 tbsp. cocoa
2 tsp. baking soda
1 tsp. salt (optional)

2 tsp. vanilla
2 tbsp. cider vinegar
2/3 c. vegetable oil
2 c. water

Stir together, just until blended. Sheet cake, 30 minutes at 350 degrees; 8 or 9 inch pan, 30 to 35 minutes at 350 degrees; bundt pan 50 to 55 minutes at 350 degrees.

CHOCOLATE FROSTING:

Confectionery sugar
Melted semi sweet morsels, chocolate
Butter
Milk